Summer sightseeing series: Inspiration from the “Mothership” – My brief trip to Portland

Editor’s note: Many of us try to escape the heat in Tucson by venturing to other locales with more favorable climes in the summer. When my family and I get to take a vacation, I often look at the place we are visiting through a cycling lens and I am sure I am not the only one. I thought it would be fun to see what other cities across the county and world have to offer by way of cycling infrastructure and community.

This week in our first Summer Sightseeing Series, Pima Association of Government’s planner, Ann Chanecka, shares her thoughts from a quick trip to Portland to check out their version of Cyclovia.

In the coming weeks we’ll hear from Tucson’s Bike and Pedestrian Program Manager, Tom Thivener about his trip to Denmark and Sweeden.

A image from Portland's Sunday Parkways. All photos by Ann Chanecka.

I know, I know – you’re sick and tired of hearing about Portland. And to be honest, so am I. While my boss jokes with me that I consider Portland to be the bicycling “mothership,” I had not been overly impressed biking around during previous visits there. However, I just returned from a short visit and this time I noticed remarkable improvements.

I walked away from the trip inspired by what is possible in a short amount of time. As the Tucson region ramps up efforts to become a platinum-level bicycle friendly community, we can learn a lot from Portland’s success.

The leadership, commitment, and innovation regarding bicycling is evident from the moment you step off a plane. The directional signs indicate where baggage, ground transportation and the “bike assembly area” are located. In fact, a few airlines waived bicycle baggage fees for Portland flights this month in honor of their Bike Month.

Bicycling has permeated the mainstream culture in Portland — something we’re still working on in Tucson. While my visit was technically a vacation, I had several observations and thoughts I’d like to share with bike enthusiasts in the Tucson region.

First, I planned my visit around Portland’s Sunday Parkways a.k.a. their Cyclovia. Wow. They’ve been doing Cyclovias for four years now, and they do multiple Cyclovias throughout the year. This summer they are holding a Cyclovia the last Sunday of each month May-September, 5 in total. Sunday’s event blew away my expectations!

I was not surprised to hear they had record crowds, and even with their estimated 35,000+ people, the event seemed to operate flawlessly. The 8-mile car-free route meandered through residential areas and there were many busy activity centers along the way.

As one of the organizers of Cyclovia Tucson I couldn’t help but wonder how Portland does it — multiple Cyclovias a year that more or less run like a well-oiled machine? Sunday confirmed my suspicion — Portland’s Cyclovia recipe seems to have a few main ingredients.

A bike boulevard sign.

1. Staff: Dedicated staff put time, energy and passion into the event.

2. Funding: There is a major financial commitment from both the City of Portland and Kaiser Permanente. However, other corporations, non-profits and their regional government also contribute funding. Key leaders in the community have decided that Cyclovia is a priority and they ensure it happens.

3. Volunteers: A small army of volunteers are recruited to make the event a great success. The Volunteer Coordinator told me he had 270 volunteers on Sunday. Many Portlanders love the event and so they give their time to it. Bicyclists in Portland are actively creating a visible cycling culture.

That was the second huge observation I made: there is a very strong and noticeable cycling culture — initiated by both grassroots efforts and government programs. I happened to be there at the end of their Bike Month where different groups organize bicycle events over roughly a month stretch, and advertise on one main community calendar.

On Saturday alone, there were 17 cycling-related events to choose from — yes, 17! Every bike shop I visited was aware of the different events and encouraged me to participate.

In addition, many of the other Portland businesses have caught onto the fever, or more realistically, the cyclists’ buying power. I lost track of the number of cafes, coffee shops, bookstores, etc., that had on-street bicycle parking, and most of them were chock-full.

Cycling is a real and viable transportation option to get to work, to run errands and to meet up with friends. It is a mainstream part of everyday life. Planners in Portland attribute the huge shift in ridership to the advocacy groups, government programs and improvements to the infrastructure.

Portland has been shifting their focus to safe bike facilities for all users. The network of low-volume, residential bikeway streets makes it possible for beginner riders to get around much of the city.

Where there are difficult connections, the city is very liberal in their use of green paint and bicycle signage – a constant reminder to vehicles to be aware and share the road. It is not surprising that bike crashes in Portland are decreasing, while the bicycle ridership rates are dramatically increasing.

So as much as I hate to admit it — I’ve finally embraced the “mothership” and have to give the Portland region huge kudos for their hard work on behalf of cyclists. As our Tucson community prepares our next bicycle friendly application, we can learn from our friends in the northwest and implement some of their proven solutions here.

66 comments
straw
straw

Thanks to Ann for the report.  Clearly a cultural shift is needed here in Tucson if we're going to achieve platinum status and continue to engage larger numbers of people in bicycle riding as transportation.  5 Cyclovias over the summer, wow!  Maybe even more impressive is 17 events over the weekend with all of the bicycle shops being aware of them.  

straw
straw

Money but not in the sense I think you imply.  Money as in strings attached governmental funding.  The block rail is available but not from a US supplier.  The TIGR grant from the feds stipulates that the bits and pieces be US sourced because the program is an economic incentive program.  

zz
zz

We can (and have) gone 'round and 'round on this. In my mind this article is about whether bikes are legitimized enough in Tucson to warrant the level of consideration for  one access point to one mall. The path improvement to Trader Joe's is a good sign. It can help build  momentum  for one mall or one whatever at a time. 

Red Star
Red Star

Again, it all comes down to the same thing: go to city council and get them to pass an ordinance that compels business owners to remediate their walls to provide bike and ped access that you like. You could try for a blanket ordinance that applies to all the malls and strip malls or take it on on a case-by-case basis (keep in mind there are what, 10,000 trillion  malls and strip malls in the Old Pueblo). Along the way you might want to engage residents of the neighborhoods for their thoughts and feelings, as well as the business owners on whom the costs of remediation will fall. Keep an open, learning mind. Also, along the way, you might try to define "out of my way" (as a cyclist) ...what, exactly, is that? 50 yards, 100 yards, a quarter mile, a half mile, one mile? Those are the difficult questions and issues that council (if it is awake), and inevitable judges and lawyers will raise with you. Pleas keep us informed...

3wheeler
3wheeler

You are right on the money on that one, Red Star.

Red Star
Red Star

Get to work on your project, right?

zz
zz

I don't know, 3wheeler, I'm sensing an undertone of negativity and discouragement in that comment.

3wheeler
3wheeler

zz,, You are extremely sharp! What he wants is for this to get bogged down in political and legal proceedings so it wouldn't get anywhere.  He knows his neighbors have deep pockets and will pay legal fees to fight it forever.  My response was as disingenuous as his.  This must be handled on a case by case basis between city transportaion depertment and property owners.  The city may not be able to make a sweet enough deal for the mall owners, but they might...  Some residential neighborhoods might like better bike and ped access to their local grocery store, but others may have the same fear that Red Star has.  In reality, we never should have got to this point.  Holes should have been mandatory from the start but the car drove the design models back then. 

Red_star
Red_star

It's considered and experienced realism, zz. It results in part from consideration of all or at least most of the factors and players involved. But Red Star doesn't want to discourage you: the crux is that you and 3wheeler will have to find a legal way for City of Tucson to compel all businesses to cut holes in their walls just to satisfy cyclists and peds. Neighborhoods be damned (?). And soon. It could be a valuable learning experience for you...who knows?

3wheeler
3wheeler

Rynsa, If every guy in Tucson who earns less than $15000/year rode his bike to work, we'd make Portland look like they didn't know what a bicycle is. Cycling is not an activity for the priviledged alone, anyone who wants to ride and doesn't have too many miles to go can do it.  It's just that driving is so very convenient it's hard to get people on a bike.  It seems to me that your conclusion about what caused Portlanders to embrace cycling in larger numbers is self contradictory.  You say they have more money, then you say no amount of infrastructure will get people on bikes.  What good is having more money if it's not spent on infrastructure?  I may not be understanding you, help me to see what you're saying.

zz
zz

You really can't sell that trivial half-mile "out of their way" to get anywhere to people you are trying to entice onto bikes. The point is in the bigger picture it seems all factions and interests take precedence over bicycles - and who would want to become a part of the group that is regarded in such a way? So, how did Portland create the image that bikes are favorable? I think it has to be more than just transcending the "trendy threshold".

3wheeler
3wheeler

zz, To a couch potato, that trivial half mile is huge.  That couch potato is who we are all talking about.  They are the people we need/want to convert/cojole/entice/seduce into our little cult.  Lance Armstrong is of no concern to this dialog, he's already drank the cool-aid and is hooked.  The Lances of the world intentionally take the long way around, but he's not the person we're concerned about. Besides, I don't get this attitude that we have streets all over that are suited to cars and that's just fine (which it is) but it's somehow immoral/lazy to advocate for a decent grid system that's suited to cycling.  If anyone really buys into the sales pitch that cycling improves individual lives and therefore society, it should follow that reasonable concessions should be made to allow cycling to flourish. My theory is that if you provide reasonably quiet roads that run reasonably direct to where people need to go, some current non-cyclists will take advantage of it.  When the remaining non-cyclists see more and more people out on bikes, it becomes more of a real possibility to them in their mind.

3wheeler
3wheeler

Rynsa, Tucson is indeed broke right now, but it won't stay that way forever.  My point is that we get more bang for the buck by cutting holes in some of the barriers we have.  Grand, seperated bike paths are wonderful but more expensive.  I'd love to have both, but if I have to choose I'd go for cutting holes. 

Red Star
Red Star

The fuzziness is understandable. Can you overcome it and cite (link to) a primary source? In any case, channeling access to El Con is probably a good thing for all involved even if it means cyclists have to ride, what, a trivial half mile "out of their way" to get to the COT Dodge interface with the mall...

straw
straw

It's the sum total of all those trivial hlf miles that wears on us.  

Red Star
Red Star

Plan your trips,  learn to use the gears on your bike, change the gearing on your bike, re-bike.  Those are some of the options.

3wheeler
3wheeler

Straw, you are right.  The argument over an east-west passage from County Club to Alvernon is a bit of a diversion; there are many other barriers that can be dealt with that wouldn't come with near as much political heat.  On the other hand, Red Star is providing a typical NIMBY reaction that can be expected with attempting to breach any number of barriers we have in town.  

3wheeler
3wheeler

Thank you, Red Star!  You are soooo making my case!!!  Pulease keep it up.

straw
straw

So you can have a walled off paradise?  How's about you come up with something a little less anecdotal for comparative crime statistics.  There are places in Pima County where nobody but the invited and or residents can get in.  Personally I'm fine riding out to Dodge and then making the illegal turn.  This particular interface is merely annoying.  There's a lot of low hanging non controversial fruit out there.  That's what I'm talking about.  The walled enclave is a mere diversion and it  detracts from the real issue for me.  How do we find ways to facilitate access for bicycles?  Low cost ways.  The cut through at 9th st being an excellent example of a success.  

3wheeler
3wheeler

Red Star, Dodge is all on private land thru the mall.

Red Star
Red Star

Dodge through the (el con) mall is public roadway.

Red Star
Red Star

"Hint: The "traffic-control" signs themselves, their height and mounting hardware, ought to be a giveaway." ( Psibley 1 Day ago) Wow, Psibley. Shorten all the stop sign posts in the Old Pueblo, change the mounting hardware and voila! All streets in Tucson magically become private property rather than public roadway! (you are confusing the signs that face Dodge from the parking lots, on private property, with legally binding, enforceable stop signs that are on public property)

zz
zz

It would probably be easier to get Wal Mart to do the dirty work.

Red Star
Red Star

zz, Looks like you'll need to contact your Tucson City Councilmember to get an ordinance passed that requires the numerous malls and strip malls to cut holes in their walls for the convenience of you and 3wheeler.

3wheeler
3wheeler

I have been giving straight up information, you have been using rhetorical devices because your position is untenable.  If average people, who are out of shape and not used to riding in traffic, are going to start riding a bike they would prefer to do it on side streets - and take the shortest route possible the first few months.  That's a no brainer.  To provide those side streets that can get you somewhere without going way out out of your way will require cutting holes in a lot of the barriers this town has.

zz
zz

I considererd the old Jones St. entrance to be preferred for bicycle use because it required the least negotiation on 5th St., a street I like to stay off of. When it was walled off, no, it probably wasn't a large cycling issue. But now, if we are really serious about increasing bike numbers, especially short trips, women riders and carrying goods, access and routes are a big deal. Reference the Trader Joe hoopla about access from the Rillito path. People with an affinity for all things Portland think bike boulevards are the answer but I think our problems and concerns are different than theirs; ours being  able to be addressed with simpler and cheaper actions. But along with each one of those comes this vicious fight...and I am sick of those. So we will get bike boulevards and look like we are addressing the problem and maybe get a platinum rating out of it - but I don't think it's what we really need.

Red Star
Red Star

Your rhetorical devices are awesome and tiresome all at the same time! It is Red Star's hope that others read this and see through (especially through your flailing frustration) to all that's involved and don't get discouraged...you know, get informed and roll up your sleeves. Thanks again 3wheeler! Regards, Red Star

3wheeler
3wheeler

I don't have a link that would be of any use to you.  Go to the city's website and find the GIS, load the autocad software and you can get all sorts of property information. Yes, I am free to try to enhance it for cyclists.  It's nice of you to say that.  I thank you for giving me a reason to elaborate in depth on this subject in this public forum.  A few of the cyclists who read our discussion may get fired up over the possibilities of an east-west route thru El Con and the surrounding neighborhoods. "But why whine?"  I have posted my logic below in a reply to zz. We went thru all your stranger danger fears in our previous discussion on this.  I have no interest in making your phobias any more public.  But I will repeat this, if you are so fearful of your fellow man, you should have moved into a gated community.  To be fair, I want bike connections thru a couple gated communities too, so that may not be safe enough for you either... Do I think of this as a cycling issue?  Of course, what else?  I have no hidden agendas.  I would like at least one decent route for bikes thru this town on every half mile, east-west and north-south.  If you live near El Con, I appplaud your hard work and drive to earn the money to afford to live in such a fine area.  I am not motivated by envy, or any other emotional concern, I want bike routes.  I'm just as anxious to get thru barrio Hollywood as I am to get thru your barrio.

Red Star
Red Star

Provide the link... In any case, Dodge and 5th is public entry to El Con Mall on public roadway. You are free to use it or not use it. You are free to try to enhance it for cyclists and free not to. But why whine? Again, people who live around the mall do not want sexual assaults, drug deals, car clouting, etc., etc., all the decades of shit, to spill over into their neighborhoods. Would you if you lived there? Hence the wall. Think about it...do you seriously, soberly see this as a cycling issue?

3wheeler
3wheeler

Red Star, The land that "Dodge" is on is private property from Broadway to the edge of the neighborhood on the north side of the mall.  It's public record, look it up on line.

zz
zz

I'm a little fuzzy on this, but the motor vehicle access to El Con from Jones (now Guapo) was supposed to be reduced to ped/bike, or so the BAC et al were told. Like other 'assurances', it just didn't turn out that way.

3wheeler
3wheeler

Rynsa, as I stated above, I think we need better connectivity in our tertiary street system before we see much more ridership.  There are many, many barriers a cross town bound cyclist encounters now.  I don't think we need bundles of money to fix the gaps in our street system.  Many of those barriers can be swept away at minimal financial cost.  The challenge is on the political side.  Are the people who live in the neighborhoods next to El Con mall going to allow holes cut in the walls for bikes and peds to flow thru?  The cost is small, cash wise, but it's not going to happen.  A path across the golf course would cost some bucks, but I think it would have more resistance from the parks department than the budget people. You can ride anywhere you want in Tucson, but many places can't be accessed without getting on an arterial for a ways.  I think that keeps a lot of people from riding.  If we had a more porous tertiary street system and a publicity system to get the word out about it, we could double our ridership.  Those things do cost money, but not nearly as much as seperated paths.

straw
straw

That wall  surrounding El Con on the north is so irksome.  It's exactly that kind of thing.  The low cost facilitation  of access that I find so lacking in tucson's bicycle pedestrian infrastructure.  If you go to the end of Jason Vista you can scramble up the hill and onto the Sam Lena bike path.  it would be nice if this was paved and advertised.  Huge shortcut if you're going to Kino or the ballpark or anywhere south and east of there.  Headed east on the Aviation Parkway path when you are wanting to get onto Palo Verde to cross you're forced to either jump the curb onto the spur of Golf Links or ride further south than you need to go to Richey and then starting on the wrong side of the road cross at a busy corner, ride through an intersection with a yield sign then climb the hill to Palo Verde.  One quick curb cut a couple of hundred yards back on the path would save all of this.  You'd be on Golf Links on the correct side of the road on a no traffic section of a dead end and you'd have no traffic control device in your path.  God yes, a path across that stupid golf course.  I hate riding around it.  The sum total of a bunch or small thing like this would be HUGE.  Thank you 3wheeler.  I've often been annoyed by that uninterrupted wall and having to ride out onto Dodge forcing my way through an intersection that was constructed to prevent cars from turning towards El Con.  The safe way to El Con from the north is via Palo Verde from the 3rd St bike path.  

3wheeler
3wheeler

Thank you, Straw.  I'm glad I am not the only cyclist to notice those hicups in our system.  Smallish outlays of money can give big returns.  We'll have to wait until the economy to improves, but I'm sure that most of these things will eventually get fixed.

Red Star
Red Star

Suggest you figure out where City of Tucson and Pima County actually own perceived impediments and make your case to them about those specific perceived impediments. Again, as for walls on private property, you'll have to go to city council, board of supervisors and get them to change the applicable city and county codes. And make the requirement retroactive.  Probability of success? Zero. And that's *not* Red Star being smug or content (or whatever other irrelevant juvenile personal attacks are allowed on these pages), that's just reality.

straw
straw

Actually I think that's just rhetoric but your point regarding how to effect a change is well taken and I did in fact advocate to the RTA/PAG folks in regards to the 9th st island fix and I will continue to identify other seemingly easy fixes, advocating to the proper authority for their implementation.  I sure hope nothing I've ever expressed in this particular blog comment section has been construed as a personal attack.  Ad hominem fallacy does not an argument make.  

Red Star
Red Star

"Are the people who live in the neighborhoods next to El Con mall going to allow holes cut in the walls for bikes and peds to flow thru?  The cost is small, cash wise, but it's not going to happen. " Right you are, but for the wrong reasons. This has come up before in these pages: http://tucsonvelo.com/forum/index.php?topic=5.0 Again, the wall was built by the owners of the mall on their private property to channel motor vehicle traffic and mitigate crime at the mall and mall parking lot and spillover to surrounding neighborhoods. It had nothing to do with cyclists. Just a thought: lobby to get segregated bike access on Dodge into the mall lot. (thinking that Dodge thereabouts is COT property, as it is).

3wheeler
3wheeler

Red Star, Yes, you and I did talk about that subject before.  It was obvious that you live in one of the neighborhoods and it made no sense to me to continue talking about it with you.  Regardless of the protest from you and your neighbors, a large public demand could convince the city to take the 100 square feet or so of land needed and cut the holes.  El Con's owners could be plied w/ a deal on parking/S.F. of store, or some other enticement.  It would take a lot of public demand to get the city to wage this battle tho and that's not likely to ever develop unless bike ridership really takes off and this issue is kept out in the public eye.  That's what I'm doing here, letting people know that they should be able to ride from Country Club to Alvernon between 5th and Broadway.  There are many other barriers in this town, but I'm happy to talk about that one right now.

straw
straw

Gotta love these long narrow columns.   Ok Red Star, you've worn me down with your compelling arguments and citations of whininess and incorrect cycling equipment.  You win.  Peace out.  

Red Star
Red Star

What are doing to effect the change you desire?

Red Star
Red Star

Once again, for the umpteenth time:  go to city council or Pima County (whichever applies), or hire a midnight crew to dynamite/sledgehammer holes in the walls, or sit around and whine about them. Or learn to use your bike. Or modify your bike.  Or get a different bike. Or worry (and bother readers) over impute v. impugn... Is Red Star missing any other options for you, straw? Do let us know...

3wheeler
3wheeler

Red Star, thanks for the link that shows the El Con mall folks were forced to build the 10' high sound abatement wall.

straw
straw

Whine and be bitter, characterising tone and assigning state of mind are not arguments.  Taking the high road means taking the high road.  I apologise for the meta.   Did you mean impute a motive or was impugn correct?  They'd both work but with very different results.  And really truly I'm just asking for clarification purposes.  Thanks

Red Star
Red Star

"They were forced into it." Red Star is reluctant to impugn a motive to the mall owners. They did what they did, for whatever reasons. 3wheeler, do you want to *force* them to cut a bike/ped hole in their wall? Go to city council. Complain about the neighborhoods and how they *force* you to go a short way (or is it a long way, for you?) out of your way on your bike. Go to city council.  Apply *force.*  Force city council to do what you want. Back to realism: http://urban-issues.com/Documents/Elcon.html Your options seem to be:  force (force, the dirty word) city council, blow up the walls you dislike, do nothing more than whine and be bitter.

straw
straw

The annoying walls were placed on whose behalf?  They abut right of way and city streets on one side.  But we're beating a dead horse here and I have zero expectation that the wall in question wil be breached any time soon.  

3wheeler
3wheeler

The mall owners may, or may not be willing to let holes be cut in the walls.  The walls are on their property but they put them up because of the outcry from the residential neighbors.  The mall didn't spend big bucks on bigger walls for the fun of it.  They were forced into it. I'm loving how you're keeping this conversation in the public eye.  Thanks.

3wheeler
3wheeler

You are exactly right, Straw.  Thank you.

Red Star
Red Star

"...but the reality is the infrastructure of streets is paid for by all of us and as such should be available to all of us. " The relevant reality is the annoying walls are on private property; they are not part of public roadway and not part of public infrastructure. If you want to change that, go to city council.

straw
straw

Nobody likes going out around, cars peds bikes.  We all hate it.  Punching a hole through that wall at either Palo Verde or Avenida Del Rio would make a huge difference for bicycle access.  Between El Encanto and the mall you're pretty much stuck for about a mile .  I think I do understand that everyone in this city would love to live on a dead end street with no access to it by outsiders but the reality is the infrastructure of streets is paid for by all of us and as such should be available to all of us.  

3wheeler
3wheeler

Another weak attempt at deflection I see. Lets put your argument into proper perspective: Lets propose that the COT tears up Broadway and tells people that they have to drive their cars on 22nd or Speedway instead.  The public would scream bloody murder.  The need for a decent grid is obvious to car drivers who don't work at all to make their vehicle go a single inch let alone an extra mile.  As cyclists, who do work to make our vehicles go, we also should be able to have a grid system that doesn't force them to go out of their way.  I am not asking for segregated bike paths thru town.  I want holes cut in the barriers (just for ped and bike access) that exist in our tertiary street grid.  Look at Google Earth and you will see how our grid system is constipated with all sorts of walls.  I mentioned barrio Hollywood a few notes past, do you know that you can't go west or east out of that neighborhood without getting on Saint Mary's or Speedway.  The river and freeway make a formidable barrier on the east, but why is there no access to Silverbell on the west? 

Red Star
Red Star

Forget the neighborhoods that bracket El Con Mall to the west, east, north. The mall is also bracketed by Country Club, Alvernon, and 5th. It's a no brainer: you cross Country Club using the TOUCAN at 3rd and take 3rd to Palo Verde across 5th to Calle Del Prado east to Dodge and into mall bliss. Same goes for getting across Alvernon: you use the TOUCAN at 3rd and Alvernon, end up at Calle Del Prado and Dodge. Head on in to mall bliss. Note that no holes were punched in walls. You didn't disrupt neighborhoods with criminal activity, you used costly city infrastructure. You went what, a mile out of your way on a bike as compared to using a car.

3wheeler
3wheeler

That's the sum of your argument, that I'm lazy?  Again, I refer you to the note I wrote below in reply to zz.  It deals with that issue.

Red Star
Red Star

Oh, c'mon! What do want, a concierge? Mostly, Midtown Old Pueblo streets are a 1930's-1950's grid. They are tight as in close together. Granted, the pavement has come to suck (COTDOT's retiring Glock suggests a mountain bike) but that's a whole 'nother issue that has to do with tax base and the economy. Roll up your sleeves if your all that bothered by going a hundred yards out of your way on your bike.

3wheeler
3wheeler

I did indeed raise the issue of El Con in my note on barriers to cycling traffic in town.  El Con and the neighborhoods to each side are just one of many impassable sections of town.  You however rose to the bait, as it were, as you did in the NIMBY discussion.  I don't say anything about the north access to El Con because there already is access there.  It could be improved, but compared to ZERO access from the east or west, it's clear there is greater reward to be had from exploring that "avenue." 

Red Star
Red Star

Man, you raised the issue of access to El Con (in what looks like a facile device to complain about cycling in the Old Pueblo in general), not Red Star. Again, the Dodge interface with the north end of El Con  could be improved for cyclists. One could reasonably say there is work to be done there. But you don't do that. You just plain don't.  Can you? Will you?

3wheeler
3wheeler

I don't think you get it, I understood what you said.  My point is that it is irrelevent. You are suggesting that only someone who has a performance record can accomplish anything.  If that were true, nothing would have gotten done from the the beginning of time down to today. And what do you mean, it doesn't matter where you live?  Of course it does.  If you live next to El Con, you have a bias that you are keeping hidden.  You are trying to maintain an air of objectivity, but your obstinance shows that you have something more invested.  BTW, what's with the third person references?

Red Star
Red Star

"Can you tell Red Star the three things you have done with City of Tucson to improve cyclist and pedestrian access to El Con on public property?" Okay, let's make it one thing...

3wheeler
3wheeler

Red Star, What are you talking about?

Red Star
Red Star

3wheeler, It doesn't matter where Red Star lives, no matter how much you think it does. Drama, angst, and wild theories are all well and good, but at some point you have to get things done. Or not. Can you tell Red Star the three things you have done with City of Tucson to improve cyclist and pedestrian access to El Con on public property?